Primarily for the sake of reference, I've opted to repost a couple of posts from the thread, Carryover From JREF, since it's petty broad and covers a lot of territory. And, since this was the main reason for starting the thread, it seems suitable that I should repost them here ... However, feel free to post too if you like.

__________________
So when the body dies, and consciousness departs, where do "we" go? ... Off to define another "reality" perhaps?

It all depends on whether you wish to accept the writings of a mystic or not. I just figured I should bring it up now since people tend to reach for their favorite interpretation without it even crossing their minds. And then to automatically try and discredit somebody else just because he was a mystic, well I think it bears repeating. So basically this is what all the hubbub regarding the Book of Revelation is all about.

If we understood that the Christian Church is the fourth in succession in the lineage of the church called the Church of Man, beginning with the Church of Adam, the Church of Noah and the Israelite Church, then we must understand that the Christian Church should also come to a close and a fifth church be established.

While typically at the end of each church something cataclysmic occurs that signifies its destruction, hence the end of times or, end of an era so to speak. For example the Great Flood signified the end of the Church of Adam, while the fall of the Tower of Babel signified the end the Church of Noah and, the captivity of the Kingdom of Judah by the Babylonians signified the end of the Israelite Church.

As for the end of the Christian Church, represented by the Roman Catholics, it began to decline and lose its power over the two centuries that the Reformation became established. While it continued to establish itself and gain power until the advent of the Age of Enlightenment which, as I said coincides with the Advent of the New Church. So at this point the Reformation, represented by the Great Red Dragon, etc. (Revelation 12-13), begins to rule and persecute those who don't abide by its doctrine, namely that faith alone saves without works (the ten commandments) which, is why it's called the Dragon and not the New Church. This was allowed to continue for a time, up until it, along with the Roman Catholic Church, represented by Babylon, the Great Whore, are ultimately dealt with and the Last Judgment is performed. Which, according to Swedenborg occurred in the spiritual world in the year 1757.

And, while I'm sure there are gobs of things I've overlooked here, if you would like to understand the lineage of the first five churches better, as well as the sixth? please refer to chapters 1-3 of my book.

Is there really a difference? This is kind of what you make it sound like. Well, perhaps with the mystic the insanity is only temporary, that is until he learns how to put his brain back together again. That's kind of what happened to me anyway. And it reflects the typical shamanistic experience which happens throughout the world. Hey, look at John the Baptist for a case in point.

I've had any number of experiences happen to me if that's what you mean, many of which I've detailed in my book. But, does that classify it as the typical "hard" evidence most people are looking for? I doubt it. However, if you were to refer to chapter 5 and chapter 9, you might inquire as to what it was I was smoking, really? although I can assure you I wasn't on drugs.

The fact that we're speaking of the unconscious mind suggests it has nothing to do with the "objective world." Are you at all familiar with Carl Jung?

__________________
So when the body dies, and consciousness departs, where do "we" go? ... Off to define another "reality" perhaps?

How about when you take the numerical value of the letters in Jesus' name, which are, 10, 5, 19, 21 and 19. When added, you get 74 which, when multiplied by 9 you get 666. That's a little strange don't you think? And, when I first heard it just about floored me, because I too have a sense for numbers, and to me the number 9 implies a sense of dead-seriousness. Please refer to chapter 4. So I'm thinking what could it possibly mean? Then I realized that most people misconstrue the anti-Christ to mean someone who is anti Christian, when in fact it's not like that at all. The anti-Christ is actually the false Christ, who appears in Jesus' name, and yet is not what he claims to be. So why can't the number 666 represent the false Jesus? (or false prophet).

Now I don't know of any other languages besides English, I suspect there are at least a few, where the numberical values of Jesus' name add up to 74. Regardless though, we are speaking of where the Reformation had its stronghold at the time the Last Judgment was performed according to Swedenborg, in Great Britain. So at least this much would be correct if the Reformation represented the Dragon, the Beast out of the Sea and the False Prophet.

We also need to understand that the only significant development of Christianity since its establishment in Rome, was the development of the Reformation. Thus we have the two key players that are supposed to appear at the advent of the New Church, the Great Dragon which is the Reformation, and Babylon the Great Whore which is the Roman Catholic Church ... where the Great Dragon is somewhat new to the scene, and Babylon the Great isn't brought into remembrance until towards the end of the judgment upon the Dragon and its crew, at which point both are ultimately judged (in the spiritual world).

__________________
So when the body dies, and consciousness departs, where do "we" go? ... Off to define another "reality" perhaps?

While here are a few other posts taken from the JREF Forums thread, Hopefully religious nutters won't see this, regarding all the speculation about the picture of the Ghost Head Nebula taken by the Hubble telescope which, I'm reposting below ...

While I know I'm going to get myself in trouble here, but I suggest the horned being represents the False Prophet in Revelation 13, and is in reference to the religious fundamentalist movement in this country, which I detail to some extent in my thread, Carryover From JREF, regarding the Reformation and its relation to the Great Red Dragon, the Beast out of the Sea, and the False Prophet in Revelation 12-13 ...

Do you believe in mysticism? No. If you did, then maybe you would understand this is how these things crop up. But hey I'm just following the general pattern here and offering up what I have to say about it.

The beast does look kind of like a lamb with two horns though doesn't it? Maybe even proclaiming something which is not very nice? You know, sort of like your typical fundamentalist rhetoric?

Also, does anyone know that by taking the individual letters in Jesus' name and adding their numerical equivalents (10 + 5 + 19 + 21 + 19) you get 74 which, when multiplied by 9 equals 666? Whoa dude! So what could that possibly suggest, except that the number 666 represents the "False-Jesus?" And who better to fit the bill than the Church of the Reformation ... aka the Protestant Church.

Of course we have yet to speak of the Roman Catholic Church which, the Book of Revelation refers to as Babylon the Great Whore in Revelation 17-18.

__________________
So when the body dies, and consciousness departs, where do "we" go? ... Off to define another "reality" perhaps?

From the JREF Forums thread, Hopefully religious nutters won't see this ...





While I recommend you follow the link or, click on the image, to understand some of the things which have been used to describe what it looks like. Very interesting thread!

__________________
So when the body dies, and consciousness departs, where do "we" go? ... Off to define another "reality" perhaps?

Whaat is really funny, is that every post is yours...

lol, anyways, regarding your second post, you said that we must expect a 5 church...there is no reason for us to suspect a fifth church, because the fourth church started when Jesus gave up his life...or when he came bak...or however u wanna look at it! But the prophecy is that he will return...we are told it could be anytime...the hour and time are unknown, there is absolutely no reason to believe that our church of worshipping God will change...i do believe it is the final chuch...unless u are talking about when we get to heaven, and then that will be the 'fifth church', but the the word 'Church' would be the wrong word to use... also, if you think there is gonna be a fifth church, then there will be a sixth, then a seventh, 8th, etc...forever and ever...amen

__________________
Nobody likes the Good Guy, thats the TRUTH!

Yes, most of the posts are mine, unless otherwise noted. And thanks! Also, it looks like I neglected to post a link to the Fifth Church which, I really should have. Sorry about that. Please follow the link ...

Also, I go into more detail in chapters 1-3 of my book if you would like to read more about it, Okay?

__________________
So when the body dies, and consciousness departs, where do "we" go? ... Off to define another "reality" perhaps?

Have also started the same thread here, The Name Jesus = 666? over at the JREF Forums, if you would like to read more on the matter ...

__________________
So when the body dies, and consciousness departs, where do "we" go? ... Off to define another "reality" perhaps?

Actually, the name of Jesus = 1010011010

(There are 10 kinds of people in the world. Those who understand binary and those who don't.)

Language and mathematics are just tools. It's the medium (the expression of reality) that determines what we do with them.

__________________
So when the body dies, and consciousness departs, where do "we" go? ... Off to define another "reality" perhaps?

Sorry, that makes no sense. Language is a medium and a tool, and you can use it either to express reality or fiction. The same is true of mathmatics.

Either that or you mean something completely different by the word medium than I have ever encountered.

No, the medium is communication, of which language and mathematics are the different aspects or tools of. So, no matter what means we use to try and communicate something, it's not going to change the fact of what it is we are trying to communicate. A rose by any other name is still a rose, right?

__________________
So when the body dies, and consciousness departs, where do "we" go? ... Off to define another "reality" perhaps?

That would mean that the notion that Jesus=666 has absolutely no relevance, since it is only communication and is not the "reality" of Jesus. Translate the bible into another language, and the numbers would be different.

So make up your mind. Is it the reality that is important, or the symbols you assign to it? If the former, then you can toss that 666 stuff out the window because those symbols are of zero importance.

Or, perhaps it's just more relevant in English?

If, in fact the name Jesus corresponds to the number 666, then those who uphold the false Jesus are still in effect associated with this number. Why else call them the false prophet then? The false prophet with respect to what? Jesus of course.

__________________
So when the body dies, and consciousness departs, where do "we" go? ... Off to define another "reality" perhaps?

No, because it is an artifact of the media. Therefore, by your own admission, it is not relevant at all. It is in no way descriptive, just the bizarre result of how you have twisted the letters. Yet, if you applied the same rules of "twisting" to the same "reality", but in another language, the result would be different. In other words, it doesn't mean anything.
What false Jesus? Where did HE come into the picture? Are you just making this stuff up as you go along?

This doesn't really have any relevance to the subject being discussed but I came across an article about NASA's spacecraft Cassini. It will land on Saturn's largest moon Titan in January 2005. I read in another article that Saturn's moon Titan in Greek totals 666. It will be interesting to see what happens. It was on a website called Revelations 13, I believe.

www.revelation13.net

LOL! Thanks, Peggy. That is a wonderful example of the kind of contortions that numerologists will go through to wring significance from insignificant things. If it doesn't work in English, try another language.

What does "Jesus" total to in Greek? If it doesn't fit into their preconceived notions, numerologists just ignore it.

That is interesting, because The Titans which, basically represent the status quo -- or, current system of things -- were the persecuters of Dionysus. In fact, I think we may have a couple of Titans on this very board.

__________________
So when the body dies, and consciousness departs, where do "we" go? ... Off to define another "reality" perhaps?

That is interesting. Of course, the Titans were the predecessors (and in some cases the parents) of the gods in Greek mythology, and as such, it wouldn't be much of a stretch to call them representative of the "status quo" because they were replaced by the gods. So indeed, this reference has some basis in classical mythology, making it one of the best ones you have ever done, Iacchy! Good work.!

Of course, if you make Titan plural then I'll bet "Titans", even in Greek doesn't add up to 666, so that part of it is wrecked. What a pity.

And if you want to see yourself as persecuted by those horrible Titans called Science and Logic, then I feel sure you will. I predict you will also conveniently ignore the fact that spirituality has been around much longer than science, making it the "status quo". But for gosh sakes, don't let evidence get in the way of a good persecution complex.

What, and you're officially keeping score here?

Ah, but what is a whole multitude of Titans, but a whole multitude of individual Titans?

Sensible folks no longer believe in spirituality do they?

__________________
So when the body dies, and consciousness departs, where do "we" go? ... Off to define another "reality" perhaps?